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Zzz's First Ruleset Evaluation and

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Author Topic: Zzz's First Ruleset Evaluation and  (Read 1545 times)
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« Reply #45 on: November 26, 2008, 02:48:00 pm »

I still don't see it. Alright with deep impact (unless you're a player who actually want deep impact for other reasons too...) but the other one i still don't see where you're going with. Alright say it is placed so crucially perfect that there's nothing you can do. Then simply don't do anything.  Problem solved. I can't think of any single spot where it'd be such a big problem though, but i'm sure by the next time i read this topic you'll have posted an endless amount of possibilites where i'll be helplessly owned by the explosives i can see from 10 miles away because they are placed so amazingly well and i'm such a scrub.

Ok
Most-popular class of weapons in the game…(regardless of version): automatics. Submachine guns, to be precise. Smallest penetration power, and benefit much much more from Extreme Conditioning or Steady Aim. I don’t want to hear some of your CCs if you consider DI a necessity on everything…I can provide a lot of examples, but that sort of defeats the purpose. There’s places you can’t go around them, unless you spawn behind one, you’re going-towards them, not coming-from. There’s only so many routes from one end to the other, which often result in bottlenecks for fast-paced, exciting battles, so they encourage Betty placement. Unlike 4, they take absolutely no know-how to utilize correctly. All of the situations you people have been giving me involve one of the counter-perks. I shouldn’t waste a perk slot to counter someone else’s. There should be a foolproof plan to trigger and avoid them like there was in 4 (claymores), and it shouldn’t be overtly difficult. It wouldn’t defeat the purpose of the perk, it just encourages savvy placement, instead of just laying them at your ass and getting a 2-1 KDR from just Bettys. And in competitive play, an entire team can basically block off an entire building with maybe two player’s supply of Bettys. When it happens, I’m going to laugh. Not just because I was right, but because you people weren’t even on the mark with the balance issues.

I'll accept that i'm overestimating the nadelauncher (although i'm hardly estimating it as i said i don't have much experience against it and none with it), but you sure as hell are also overestimating the BBs. Or maybe you are on purpose overestimating them simply to make a point? 

No. I’m not overestimating them if I’ve had plenty of experience using them and going against them. Are you familiar with the term? I played the beta, and I told you people just about all that I knew from it. The grenade launcher sucks. Zero range, horrible velocity and the explosion (compared to the beta) is hardly enough to kill someone. Basically requires a well-placed shot. Compared to Bettys – the real guaranteed 2-kills-per-death. Plant one on the staircase basically any house on Upheaval and plant the other after one blows up. 2 kills a death. Definitely not harder than priming, firing and aiming a rifle grenade. Lowest kill speed in the game, third-lowest blast radius. Get over yourselves, its moronic.

"Lag, lag lag. If you find that annoying, buy a console that’s actually capable of providing a decent online experience. Until then, don’t dissect the game logic until you’ve completely distorted the actual game. "

What i get from this quote is that the lag makes the nadelaunchers more powerful and because this isn't the case in other games it should be disregarded in the wii version? Sounds pretty dumb to me. If MoH didn't lag the bazooka that you didn't want me to compare it to would hardly be a problem either so i guess we should now go back and not just change it back to limit 1, but allow everyone to use it. Oh and in case you didn't notice i'll once again say i had no hard opinion on it yet anyway so how am i dissecting it? To me it seems more like you are anti-dissecting it for me questioning and speculating, and using the scrub point of view being: "If something's in the game, then it has to be fair so don't even THINK about turning this off".


This is basically the answer I’ve heard from anyone who’s ever complained about rifle grenades. Again, something that didn’t involve you. According to them, lag allows people to live longer and have a much longer opportunity to launch both grenades. Again, console lag. Buy this game for the PC and tell me rifle grenades contribute to any sort of competitive play. Same with the bazooka. Lower explosive damage than the frag grenade, but everybody complained about it. It’s not a very hard weapon to do well with, but you could do better with actual guns. Either lag shoot better or admit to lag shooting being entirely based on luck and as such completely undermine ‘competitive Wii gaming’, as its based entirely on luck. Does that not mean that the person using the grenade needs a decent amount of luck to kill someone, especially considering the grenade has to be precise as it is? Either way, trap’t. All you people who’ve brought the drama about other consoles (360 not-having lag, to me at least) which according to them changes the game logic completely - have absolutely no idea what the principle behind lag-shooting is. Missing intentionally to kill someone. Sort of a gamble.

Also skill isn't always needed to know alot about a game. Often the most skillfull players in games don't know as much about the metagame and balance as those who wants to get better and study the game.

There isn’t a lot of skill required to do well in CoD4/CoDWaW. Its based almost entirely on map knowledge, understanding of weapon range/damage limitations and the usefulness of any given perk in any situation. A lot of perks are incredibly versatile and as such are used often. That knowledge leads to the development of competitive – or skilled, play.

Multi-shot sure yeah it's situational. I was merely making a point. It is my fault for dying? Alright let me laugh back at you here then. Why are you even arguing that 2<3 then? It's irellevant because he'll get 0<3. Why go ahead and say he will get those 2 because here you are clearly saying he won't? I said IF he can get those 2 he WILL also have 2 opportunities to switch to a new weapon. That is unless the player he went up against used the same weapon of course 

A multi-shot rifle grenade happens about as often as a double-Molotov or Betty. All of them have a way low explosive splash to be considered an actual possibility. Outside of HQ, I’ve very rarely gotten double-RG kills. They’d get two kills a death, unless they got incredibly lucky. They either have to collect another weapon or actually try to use their rifle, be it the Garand or any BA…probably not going to work out very well for them. Unless it’s the G43 – hardly a different story. With Stopping Power he can only kill 5 people a clip, as opposed to 10 a Thompson clip, or 16 an MP40 clip. Provided he lands every shot on every person he sees. RGs without Fireworks have a very low explosive radius, so he’d be able to kill 3 people a clip, provided he landed every hit before they recovered (so he connects all non-lethal hits within 5 seconds of the first hit). Not going to happen, as is most people can hardly hit twice. Lool. Switching weapons makes sense. If you’re going to argue that that strategy can be broken, then disallow SMGs. Problem solved.

"The rest are mediocre at best, especially bolt-actions. They’re completely outclassed by every other weapon in the game and the rifle-grenade is basically they’re only redeeming factor apart from the sniper scope."

Oh and now you go back to say rifle nades aren't bad so in the end it is not entirely my fault if someone with it kill me 


Rifle grenades keep them from being outclassed by every other weapon in the game, retard. Seriously. Semi-automatic rifles (with the exception of the Garand, because of the 444 RPM fire cap) can either OSOK in **** at 1200 RPM or 2-shot in Core at 1200 RPM. Only one semi-automatic rifle has a rifle-grenade, and the sights are fairly meh. If a Carbine had a rifle-grenade, your stupid logic might have some bearing. Might. Most likely won’t, but might. Bolt-action rifles have the lowest RPM in the game, basically enough to nerf them in a game where it takes 2, sometimes 3 hits to die. Their OSOK ability means diddly when it requires such an impossibly accurate shot without Stopping Power.

I'd appreciate if you could try to showcase your knowledge about this game in a proper way instead of just coming off as arrogant with medicore unfinished arguments. But then again maybe your knowledge isn't really as good as you try to make it seem seeing as you also completely disregarded the problems i earlier put up about the reward people for doing well system which in your eyes is COMPLETELY FAIR. (and i vaguely remember someone IN that topic mentioning that these rewards aren't used in clanwars on your precious **** consoles either)

Aww! That little console shot was adorable.

Kill streaks are usually disallowed with the exception of the recon plane – and I agree with that. Artillery shell-shock does more than the actual artillery itself, and dogs are humping insane on the Wii (dogs on **** playlists on the 360 is a complete massacre). Treyarch balanced IW’s engine. A lot of imbalanced things in CoD4 were never disallowed from competitive play- they removed perk 1s for the sake of pacing. It can be very boring waiting for one end to run at each other’s claymores, same with Bettys. My suggestion has been to remove perk 1s, not that RGs are completely fair. They’re as balanced as everything, but it’s unfair to remove them from competitive play while you’re leaving in the things that slow the game pacing. I’m not saying that every round should start with people firing rifle grenades, I’m saying take it one step further. Same with kill streak benefits. They basically guarantee the side with a player that gets to 7 fastest is going to win. It makes competitive play have more to do with individual skill than teamwork. Ok?

And if that doesn't work then just don't try to talk to people. Especially not to those who are not even actually whining about being killed by the gun in the first place. But alright if you didn't get brain i of course can't expect you to realise that i several times pointed out that i had yet to get pissed by being killed by a rifle nade. Nor can i expect you to understand that i don't main a MG even though i have said that so extremely many times already. I mainly use the shotguns. You know those guns where you also know the absolute and only good perk combinations to.

I was never really talking to you until you tried dragging me down to your horrendous logic. I spoke collectively – I didn’t attack you. I don’t care what you use. It doesn’t help me sleep any better at night knowing you use shotguns. I never targeted you. You just brought this down on yourself and decided it was your business.

You know those guns where you also know the absolute and only good perk combinations to.

What is this I don't even
« Last Edit: November 26, 2008, 02:49:49 pm by Wii Troopers. Join today! » Report Spam   Logged





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« Reply #46 on: November 26, 2008, 04:05:33 pm »

Ug, why don't you people just stop spamming grenades and just save it to throw at the landmines instead. 2x grenades for 2 landmines?
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« Reply #47 on: November 26, 2008, 06:21:47 pm »

what about skype? is skype banned?
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« Reply #48 on: November 26, 2008, 06:26:59 pm »

what about skype? is skype banned?
On gamebattle matches, it is. <_<
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« Reply #49 on: November 26, 2008, 10:04:10 pm »

Anwh1stle im not reading that  Huh?
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Not a bad idea if "[ Nds ][ /Nds ]" made your text selection into caps.
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« Reply #50 on: November 27, 2008, 12:11:45 am »

I don't care if you read it, that was basically the only post actually directed at someone. There's a few snippets the rest of you may find useful.


I just want to see Mr. Know-it-All's logic defeat itself. I want this thing to escalate.
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« Reply #51 on: November 27, 2008, 04:02:22 am »

So far I only agree with Rambo, Somebody114, and of all people, OhioLawyer

I find the posts by Anwhistle and the random European to be hillarious.   First of all, stop relating this game to XBOX or whatever **** up system you play.  They are completely different

Bouncing betties are one of the easiest parts of the game to counter.  I see no argument to call them broken.  The ONLY times I ever run into them is when I'm in a tight situation and I'm forced to go somewhere I don't really want to go.  This ONLY happens when I'm in an area I shouldn't be, at a time I know I shouldn't be there.  I never run to places that are infested with mines during serious matches.  Only a MORON will say, "hmm... I know 4 enemy players are near here, and I think they are behind this wall.  Hmmmm.  I think I'll run around the corner and kill them all with my rifle grenade!"

Rifle grenades are broken I don't care what perk you use.  Rifle grenades results in a FREEEEEEE KILLLLL.  Lets say homeboy has a anti explosive perk on, BIG **** DEAL, rifle grenade stuns them and loads fast enought to launch a second, STILL giving you a free 1-2 kills per spawn.  And if they are compeltely noob and accidently kill themselves in the process, guess what, they still get points.




I agree with OhioLawyer, kill streaks are the only thing in this game encouraging people to stay alive after getting 2 kills.  Otherwise some AOW moron will gladly suicide and take his 20 points. 

Anwhistle obviously mains rifle grenade, which is ok its a great weapon, but WT will be playing rifle grenade 1 player limit, or rifle grenade banned.  It is a joke weapon, not sure how it got added into this game




WT's 2 teams will be having 5 wars each next week.  If any clans here are interested in facing WTa or WTf, contact me on AIM at Zzzfilesk1
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« Reply #52 on: November 27, 2008, 07:58:52 am »

That random european was known as a gamer longer than wt has been alive.

He was/is and always will be, BETTER THAN YOU.  Afro

Oh, *inb4anwhistlerapespost*
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« Reply #53 on: November 27, 2008, 10:20:23 am »

Clan loyalty, Yay!
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« Reply #54 on: November 27, 2008, 10:58:43 am »

Clan loyalty, Yay!
Shudap you...  Tongue
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« Reply #55 on: November 27, 2008, 10:27:12 pm »

So Zzz is calling other people a joke now? I guess there’s a first time for everything…



So, which side of Zzz is talking here? The competitive, Wii-gaming master side, or the one whose had a game for two **** weeks and should shut the hell up?

Zero competitive experience, and never played four. I’ll choose the later.

You’ve played against scrubs since you’ve had the game. I like hearing that you die from Bettys only if they’re placed in incredibly obvious places, because it basically does more to support my argument than I could have. WT hasn’t done anything competitive yet, so you won’t know that the spring-activated frag grenade really is worse off than you think.

Nobody cares if you walk into a Betty in the middle of a field once or twice a round. We’re talking about correct placement; anybody with an education higher than that of a 9 year old can leave it at their ass and maybe get 1-2 kills a death from them. Correct placement is another story, though definitely not difficult. They’re basically unavoidable unless one of your teammates is using Flak Jacket. Bomb Squad does **** all, you can spot them, big **** whoop. I can point to England on a map; it doesn’t actually mean everyone there is going to die, now does it? And lol @ your logic. Team speak makes Bettys balanced…okay. GB disallows TS basically because it can be considered many different things according to their loose-fitting rules. Intentional lagging (Skype) or some sort of outside devices used to provide an advantage. So we either choose between the corrupt, self-serving WT ‘ladder system’ or the communication-less and fair GB system. Hmmm.

There’s a reason Perk 1s are banned in CoD4 competitive play – matches become incredibly drawn-out and stale with the entire side using claymores (4’s version of the Betty, but it wasn’t nearly as OP).

If they disallowed the claymore, they’d have to get rid of x 3 frag, x 3 special…basically anything that provided an advantage. And guess what? The under-barrel grenade launcher is disallowed too. If you got rid of the rifle grenade, you’re encouraging Bettys, basically because the RG’s a tool for faster-paced fights and sort of keeps people from remaining static. That’s basically all it did in 4, and that’s basically all it does here. I could give two shits about people who **** main the damn thing straight off the hop.

Outlaw RGs, outlaw Bettys
Outlaw Bettys, outlaw the Bazooka. Very little deviation and a scope make the thing the basic runner-up
Outlaw the Bazooka, outlaw x 2 primary grenades, because that’d basically be the only perk 1 worth using
Outlaw 2 primaries, outlaw 3 tabun gas. Same ****, except these **** your teammates so they aren’t too useful. Still, they’re basically an everything-else-is-gone-may-as-well sort of thing.

Eventually you get down to everybody using Bomb Squad, or maybe the Flamethrower vs. dogs. May as well not-have perk 1s, because you’ll see very little CW diversity if people are allowed to have Bettys. Who in the right mind would actually take the effort to RG someone when you could do absolutely nothing and just have them die from advancing into your quintessential mine field?

Rifle grenades, on the other hand aren’t nearly as imbalanced. Precise shot, low RoF, low splash…insert rewashed argument you’re incapable of comprehending. For someone who apparently read and laughed at the thread, you obviously didn’t absorb anything out of it. Every explosive has the shell-shock effect. Wha, they’re stunned. Really? Is it that bad, Mr. Z? Are they entirely incapable of continuing to fire, reload, or move? No. They just move at 2/3 their original speed and can’t sprint. For maybe a split second. Very imbalanced side effect, I know. Free kills, read rewashed argument again. Lrn2notrunandgun
Lrn2midrangerifle

Zzz spends more time bitching about what other people main than he does playing the game, which hurts a Nintendo gaming master of his caliber. Get rid of perk 1s, don’t just leave Bettys because you’re an idiot and have never played against correctly placed ones.

And about the console shot…yeah, I forgot a reskin made it completely different. I forgot buying a plasma screen meant I’ll get completely different TV than my old cable one. Seriously, since when have console differences had anything to do with the game logic? You’re butthurt about rifle grenades because you’re on the receiving end of the manhammer projectile they launch. Use them yourself, same with everything in the game. I do not give a **** **** what you consider worthy of Zzz’s talent. I find it hard to take you seriously that RGs are truly an affront to competitive play in the face of perk 1s as a whole. They’re intended for a technical advantage, and I’m fairly sure passing it up for a grenade launcher isn’t imbalanced compared to some of the other perk 1s you can have.
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« Reply #56 on: November 28, 2008, 02:11:03 am »

Yes, you're a moron

It seems WT will not be facing F5 in COD5.  F5 is the only clan 100% supporting rifle grenade use in clan wars

When you start seeing the COD5 meta game, and learn how to look both ways before crossing a street, maybe then you will be worthy of our wrath

WT has private practices twice a week.  I play more private games now than public.  I played public only to rank up to get more guns. 

If you think this game is fair now, wait until you see the glitches we've found


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« Reply #57 on: November 28, 2008, 02:14:50 am »

We will also be banning Makin from our wars.  We have discovered a severe glitch that allows you to swim around the level and knife people, without being killed.  You can also shoot people from beyond the nets in the water, and snipe from basically anywhere outside the map.  Video to come soon.  We aren't going to show people how to use it, so that this game doesnt' become another MOHH2
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« Reply #58 on: April 28, 2010, 12:41:34 am »

Lag >__>


If you're going to ban the most-stupid thing ever, get rid of the really broken thing. Again, another scrub who never played 4. You can avoid Claymores, you can't avoid, spot or survive Bettys. Clays were effective, and encouraged proper placement. Here, you just put a Betty underwater near the covered sniper tower on Makin and behind the barrel on the dock and you're guaranteed 2 kills a death.

Sometimes things lag really bad in the Wii. I've stood still firing a G43 at a Betty and they finally explode after the third, sometimes 5th shot, despite me having it in the center of the Aperture. Run near them and live? Wat? I've had them blow up AROUND cover and still kill me in the Wii version. That strategy is stupid because it requires knowledge of their placement and very rarely works, even in the 360 version (the better, lagless, An-knows-what-he's-talking-about-so-stfu-scrub version). Even with the grenades, in lag they might not go off. Congrats, you wasted your primary. WOOO

Even in the 360 the splash risks killing teammates or yourself. Few people place Bettys intelligently in the Wii version, most leave them at their ass so they're easy to avoid. In the 360, people hole themselves up in towers with them behind stair cases, so frag-detonation is unlikely, as well as attempting to trigger-and-avoid them.


Rifle grenade, lowest explosive blast radius in the game other than the Bouncing Betty or the Molotov Cocktail. Play the beta if you want an idea of a mildy overpowered attachment, really. Lowest kill speed, and has to be primed when you switch to it. Everyone uses automatic weapons on the Wii version so claiming they never die/have hits register is asinine. lrn2bebetter.
wh0mg ann knows everything!!!!1111
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Um, staunch evolutionist scientists will tell you there is no scientific evidence that evolution exists. 
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« Reply #59 on: April 28, 2010, 06:27:08 am »

bump Tongue
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nice auto lock on the sniper rifle, i know a hack when i see it. use a real gun.

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