Laughing Turd
Global Moderator
WU Guru
    
Karma: 246
Offline
Clan: Dragon Boys
Posts: 23396
Maldita mi duda fue fatal.
|
 |
« on: July 26, 2013, 10:08:56 am » |
|
http://www.eurogamer.pt/articles/digitalfoundry-ps3-system-software-memory_1Unfortunately the article is in Portuguese but from what I could translate, the rest is going to be reserved for OS things. 4.5 gigs are confirmed for every game and I think devs can request an additional 1 gb of "flexible" RAM though bringing the total to 5.5 gb of usable RAM. I also believe it says that both the PS4 and Xbone reserve 2 entire cores for OS functions. They're wondering what kind of features the PS4 are going to have because at first the PS4 was going to ship with 4 gb gddr5 ram and only 512 mb reserved for OS functions. The difference is pretty big. I'm waiting for the English article to be released. I'll post it when it's out and we'll see how well I can translate.  I'm not liking it already though.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Turboweasle
Administrator
WU Guru
Karma: 228
Offline
PSN: Turboweasle
Posts: 16556
Turboweasle: everyone's favorite speedy rodent
|
 |
« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2013, 12:08:47 pm » |
|
Not sure why they need 3.5 GB of DDR5 RAM for their OS. 2 GB should be more than enough, no?
|
"And I also told the students that, for the sake of humanity's future, I hoped they were all sterile." - Ignatius Reilly. Never mind what your daughter is taught in school; what she remembers is what she has learned from you. Anti-Noob Fortress of Veteraness Council Member ~Turboweasle~ I NEVER squeeze my jubblies, so that stuff wouldn't work for me.
|
|
|
|
the KR3AT3R
Guest
|
 |
« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2013, 12:40:43 pm » |
|
I don't know Tech-agese language. I just buy systems and play. 
|
|
|
|
|
Turboweasle
Administrator
WU Guru
Karma: 228
Offline
PSN: Turboweasle
Posts: 16556
Turboweasle: everyone's favorite speedy rodent
|
 |
« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2013, 01:01:56 pm » |
|
Basically, Sony wants the PS4 to operate very smoothly, and they want the XMB (or whatever they end up going with) to operate smoothly when you're in-game, no matter the game. They also want every game on the PS4 to be displayed at 30 FPS at 1080p natively. This means that they need to devote memory to both the operating system, which handles the XMB, and the game. Turns out that the operating system is going to require almost half of the PS4's memory, which is quite a lot. Turd and I aren't happy about that, because it means some games, like Killzone 4, might get bottlenecked if they need more than 4.5 GB of memory.
|
"And I also told the students that, for the sake of humanity's future, I hoped they were all sterile." - Ignatius Reilly. Never mind what your daughter is taught in school; what she remembers is what she has learned from you. Anti-Noob Fortress of Veteraness Council Member ~Turboweasle~ I NEVER squeeze my jubblies, so that stuff wouldn't work for me.
|
|
|
Laughing Turd
Global Moderator
WU Guru
    
Karma: 246
Offline
Clan: Dragon Boys
Posts: 23396
Maldita mi duda fue fatal.
|
 |
« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2013, 07:17:23 pm » |
|
Well, I don't think it will bottleneck anything simply because you still have up to 5.5 gigs of really, really fast GDDR5 RAM. But yes, they seem to want a really smooth operating menu.
The odd thing about it is that the PS4 didn't have 8 gigs of RAM up until the right before the public unveil. They had only secured 4 gigs of GDDR5 by that time and the OS was also reported to be around 500 mb. The jump from 500mb to almost 3 GIGS is really crazy. How in the world did they bloat it up that much?
Again, I highly doubt 5.5gb is going to bottleneck anything at all (rumors are that BF4 runs at full 1080p 60fps) because the RAM they have is very competent for graphics. Modern GPU's will also have anywhere from 1-6 gigs of that same ram. PS4 still has a huge advantage over the Xbox even with the loss of RAM (also, xbox uses the same amount for their OS).
Just a bit unfortunate because I'd rather have them have the option of that much more memory instead of having a really complex OS.
|
|
|
|
|
Crzy
|
 |
« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2013, 07:22:16 pm » |
|
Would that Streaming feature of any game be a feature of the OS? Could even be that cross-game chat that the 360 has and now the PS4 is getting.
I would rather have cleaner looking games and framerate than an XMB that loads faster...:/ I mean, once I'm in-game I hardly use the XMB anyway.
|
|
|
|
Turboweasle
Administrator
WU Guru
Karma: 228
Offline
PSN: Turboweasle
Posts: 16556
Turboweasle: everyone's favorite speedy rodent
|
 |
« Reply #7 on: July 26, 2013, 07:30:56 pm » |
|
Well, I don't think it will bottleneck anything simply because you still have up to 5.5 gigs of really, really fast GDDR5 RAM. But yes, they seem to want a really smooth operating menu.
The odd thing about it is that the PS4 didn't have 8 gigs of RAM up until the right before the public unveil. They had only secured 4 gigs of GDDR5 by that time and the OS was also reported to be around 500 mb. The jump from 500mb to almost 3 GIGS is really crazy. How in the world did they bloat it up that much?
Again, I highly doubt 5.5gb is going to bottleneck anything at all (rumors are that BF4 runs at full 1080p 60fps) because the RAM they have is very competent for graphics. Modern GPU's will also have anywhere from 1-6 gigs of that same ram. PS4 still has a huge advantage over the Xbox even with the loss of RAM (also, xbox uses the same amount for their OS).
Just a bit unfortunate because I'd rather have them have the option of that much more memory instead of having a really complex OS.
The site you linked to claimed that Killzone 4 used 4.6 GB of memory, so it's not impossible for something to bottleneck, although I agree it's unlikely. Would that Streaming feature of any game be a feature of the OS? Could even be that cross-game chat that the 360 has and now the PS4 is getting. Don't quote me on this because there's a tiny, tiny chance I could be wrong, but almost certainly that's going to be handled by the OS since it works for every game. Handling developers doing that individually for their games would be hell.
|
"And I also told the students that, for the sake of humanity's future, I hoped they were all sterile." - Ignatius Reilly. Never mind what your daughter is taught in school; what she remembers is what she has learned from you. Anti-Noob Fortress of Veteraness Council Member ~Turboweasle~ I NEVER squeeze my jubblies, so that stuff wouldn't work for me.
|
|
|
Laughing Turd
Global Moderator
WU Guru
    
Karma: 246
Offline
Clan: Dragon Boys
Posts: 23396
Maldita mi duda fue fatal.
|
 |
« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2013, 07:46:01 pm » |
|
Yeah they use a lot of memory for KZ but also think they they're just going nuts with everything simply because it's there. I think once devs really start optimizing and better managing their use of RAM, you'll probably see that it's still a lot of memory. PS3 and Xbox only had a maximum of 512mb of usable ram for games AND OS. GDDR5 has really high bandwidth compared to what they used in PS360. That means that it can do a ton load more work faster, and that's not even taking into account the large jump in quantity. 5.5gb is honestly enough. Some still don't know what to do with it all: http://www.gamekicker.com/xbox_360/contrast-dev-on-ps4%E2%80%B2s-8-gb-gddr5-ram-still-scratching-our-heads-as-to-what-to-do-with-it-allWould that Streaming feature of any game be a feature of the OS? Could even be that cross-game chat that the 360 has and now the PS4 is getting.
I would rather have cleaner looking games and framerate than an XMB that loads faster...:/ I mean, once I'm in-game I hardly use the XMB anyway.
Those things will obviously make use of the OS in order for you to access them but as far as recording goes, I don't believe it has any impact at all on RAM usage. It's handled by a separate small processor so it doesn't even effect the main CPU. Cross game chat does take up a bit of memory but it's nothing, not even close to the large amount of usage we're seeing here. Also, keep in mind that it's still not confirmed by Sony at all. Eurogamer has "sources" that made this claim.
|
|
|
|
Turboweasle
Administrator
WU Guru
Karma: 228
Offline
PSN: Turboweasle
Posts: 16556
Turboweasle: everyone's favorite speedy rodent
|
 |
« Reply #9 on: July 26, 2013, 07:51:29 pm » |
|
Yeah they use a lot of memory for KZ but also think they they're just going nuts with everything simply because it's there. I think once devs really start optimizing and better managing their use of RAM, you'll probably see that it's still a lot of memory. PS3 and Xbox only had a maximum of 512mb of usable ram for games AND OS. GDDR5 has really high bandwidth compared to what they used in PS360. That means that it can do a ton load more work faster, and that's not even taking into account the large jump in quantity. 5.5gb is honestly enough.
That's true. I wonder how long the PS4 devkit has been out? How long has KZ4 been in development? Because you're right, optimization will definitely bring that number down. Right now it's looking like, what with the indie support and very nice price tag, that the PS4 is going to be a better option when compared to me upgrading to a better PC gaming rig.
|
"And I also told the students that, for the sake of humanity's future, I hoped they were all sterile." - Ignatius Reilly. Never mind what your daughter is taught in school; what she remembers is what she has learned from you. Anti-Noob Fortress of Veteraness Council Member ~Turboweasle~ I NEVER squeeze my jubblies, so that stuff wouldn't work for me.
|
|
|
Laughing Turd
Global Moderator
WU Guru
    
Karma: 246
Offline
Clan: Dragon Boys
Posts: 23396
Maldita mi duda fue fatal.
|
That's another thing. I've read the devkits are still changing even now so all of these bloated OS claims can still very well be false.
I think that it's shaping up to be the best option as well. I'll probably preorder one as soon as I can but the way I see it, PCs are just making huge performance leaps a lot faster than consoles. I think I'll buy the PS4 and use it for 3 or 4 years while I save up for really good PC parts and then make a full transition to that. I'll buy consoles after a few years when prices drop and they have good libraries.
|
|
|
|
Turboweasle
Administrator
WU Guru
Karma: 228
Offline
PSN: Turboweasle
Posts: 16556
Turboweasle: everyone's favorite speedy rodent
|
I'm thinking the same thing about a top-line gaming PC, but maybe a couple years earlier. My current laptop is fine for now.
And that's interesting, I assumed the devkits would be pretty concrete by now, considering they're launching in like 5 months or something. That said I'm kind of pleased that they're not done tweaking it. More work probably isn't a bad thing when it comes to hardware/OS optimization.
|
"And I also told the students that, for the sake of humanity's future, I hoped they were all sterile." - Ignatius Reilly. Never mind what your daughter is taught in school; what she remembers is what she has learned from you. Anti-Noob Fortress of Veteraness Council Member ~Turboweasle~ I NEVER squeeze my jubblies, so that stuff wouldn't work for me.
|
|
|
|
|
|