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Clan CK

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« Reply #30 on: August 03, 2009, 06:14:22 pm »

I Person B learned from many mistakes, then he won't be able to get an opportunity to be as successful as Person A because Person B would make a lot of mistakes and no one would want him.

Person A will always be more successful than Person B.

Incorrect assumption my friend. A lot of employers like people who have taken risks, made mistakes, and learned from them. It shows more character, it typically shows creativity, and eagerness. Someone who has consistently performed in the same capacity is not always viewed in the same light.

I could certainly challenge you to share your personal experience with mistakes in the working world and the views of managers, etc.
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« Reply #31 on: August 03, 2009, 06:19:46 pm »

I've never made mistakes in the working world, besides being tardy.
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« Reply #32 on: August 03, 2009, 06:33:31 pm »

Getting a guy who fails at everything is not a good thing. If a guy has done better, he will be chosen. Simple as that. Harvard won't grab Joe dip shit off the streets because he made mistakes. They will take Mr. Jones since he has shown he can perform at a higher level, with fewer mistakes.
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« Reply #33 on: August 03, 2009, 06:36:11 pm »

how big of a mistake can you possibly make at mc donalds?  forget the fries?  put the secret sauce when they didnt want it?

and about the person A always being more successful, thats wrong.  In my line of work, people go to school for multiple years, and think they know what they are doing just because a piece of paper tells them they do.  And the majority of those people fail in the business compared to the ones who started from the ground up, going by trial and error and a knowledge of the basic principles.  It just make us stronger people. 
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« Reply #34 on: August 03, 2009, 06:38:41 pm »

how big of a mistake can you possibly make at mc donalds?  forget the fries?  put the secret sauce when they didnt want it?

and about the person A always being more successful, thats wrong.  In my line of work, people go to school for multiple years, and think they know what they are doing just because a piece of paper tells them they do.  And the majority of those people fail in the business compared to the ones who started from the ground up, going by trial and error and a knowledge of the basic principles.  It just make us stronger people. 

A lot of trade industries will be like this. That's not mistakes, that's inexperience. Experience and mistakes can be entirely different.
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« Reply #35 on: August 03, 2009, 06:43:03 pm »

so is Joe Dipshit not going to be accepted for making mistakes, or not having experience?  He may lack experience in the mean time, but who is to say that he wont become more successful than the other guy?
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« Reply #36 on: August 03, 2009, 06:44:36 pm »

so is Joe Dipshit not going to be accepted for making mistakes, or not having experience?  He may lack experience in the mean time, but who is to say that he wont become more successful than the other guy?

His track record follows him. Not many people will take employees with negative pasts. Hence why many companies will do things like security checks on you and your family.
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« Reply #37 on: August 03, 2009, 06:46:18 pm »

I don't agree with that. Mistakes are absolutely the best learning experience. You have to make the mistakes yourself in order to gain the most experience. So, someone who makes very few mistakes has fewer opportunities to learn and more than likely won't be as successful.


Lol.  Imagine Donald Trump if he had never made a bad choice.  He'd be a god.

Your argument in based on learning from mistakes; my argument is based on knowing better than doing something a certain way and not needing to learn f
But, assuming someone doesn't sit in a padded room all day and actually makes decisions, wouldn't you say that the person in question was wise if he never needed to learn from mistakes because he made the right choices?  Mistakes are great to learn from, but sometimes it just serves as a wake-up slap to the people who go through life sleeping; if you're already awake, what good would a wake-up slap do?

I don't disagree that if you do everything perfectly then obviously you should have a perfect life. However, there's a big difference between doing everything perfectly and 'making the right choices'. Nobody can do everything perfectly so I won't talk about that point any longer. In terms of 'making the right choices', I again agree that you can go through life (and have a good life) by always making what appears to be the right choice. But that doesn't make you the most successful (as 3d stated).

Of course we could always get into the discussion on 'what does successful mean?'. Typically it means wealth, power, status, etc. I assume that is 3d's definition of success.

If that's the case then ask Donald Trump how many mistakes he's made and if he's learned from each mistake and become more successful because of it. How many times has he been on the brink of bankruptcy.

Quote:

"It is not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, and spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows in the end the triumph of high achievement; and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory nor defeat."

– Theodore Roosevelt, 1910

Here are a couple of examples of failures that I Google'd:

Two other failures you may have heard of are Levi Strauss and Christopher Columbus. Strauss headed for the gold mines of California in hopes of gold and glory. But he found none. Instead, this failure gave him new knowledge of a gap in the marketplace. He began selling pants out of canvas for the miners that were succeeding. Today, we've all heard of Levi Strauss jeans. Columbus failed miserably on his goal to find a route to India . However, in failing he ran into a new opportunity.. that of the new world. By taking action and learning from your mistakes and failures, you'll gain new knowledge and become aware of many new opportunities. When you come to the edge of what you know, it's time to make some mistakes.

http://www.woopidoo.com/articles/allis/mistakes-article.htm

Lol.  Imagine Donald Trump if he had never made a bad choice.  He'd be a god.  How is he a better person from making mistakes when he had the opportunity to never make a single mistake in his life?  Making the right choices does not equal perfection, but it is possible, as, like Solisero said, failure and success are relative, therefore perfection is relative.  The thought that making the wrong decision benefits you in the long run in comparison to making the right decision making a lesser benefit in the long run is absurd.

Your argument in based on learning from mistakes; my argument is based on knowing better than doing something a certain way and not needing to learn from a mistake that never happened.  Let's look at this example:

You work with the stock market.  Your boss wants you to make some investments for this large company.  You accept, and find that you have two options to consider: a high-risk, high-reward investment, or something comparable to a government bond.  Being the risk-taker you are, you go with the risky investment.  However, the price drops drastically on the product you invested in, and the company who you invested for goes bankrupt as a result.  How do you think your boss feels about that?  How do you think the company and all the people now out of a job feel?  Sure, from now on you may be more cautious, but that certainly doesn't help you, your boss, or the aforementioned recently-unemployed, does it?

Let's rewind a bit-- this time, you take the safe bet.  The next day, you watch the bottom fall out of the risky investment.  You say to yourself, "Whew, glad I played it safe this time."  Your boss, pleased with your insight, gives you a promotion.  The company you invested for continues to prosper and gain interest off the government bond.  Everyone's happy.

You seem to be thinking that you can only learn from mistakes, when, in reality, you can learn (or, rather, reinforce your decision-making tendencies) by watching yourself make the right choices and reminding yourself to think things through.  You benefit yourself in that moment and in the future, whereas making the wrong choice, though potentially useful in the future, does not benefit you in that moment, and has the potential to ruin any chance of prosperity down the road.

Therefore, making good decisions is better than making bad decisions.  I don't see how anyone could believe any differently.

I think something else that most of you are forgetting is that this is not a real-world, position-contingent argument; the subject is not, "If you're in this position, making mistakes doesn't matter."  Rather, it is, "Does making a mistake benefit me greater now and in the long run when compared to not making a mistake now and learning from the fruits of my wisdom?"
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« Reply #38 on: August 03, 2009, 07:02:57 pm »

Topic hijack achieved

... Im joining this clan
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« Reply #39 on: August 03, 2009, 07:04:20 pm »

Who doesn't love McDonalds???
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« Reply #40 on: August 03, 2009, 07:14:46 pm »

Who doesn't love McDonalds???

Burger King and Taco Bell pwn McDonalds, but I do like the Double Quarter Pounder Azn
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between the 3 of them or how ever many where there one of them could of got the gun and pointed it at him and told him to gtfo. Its that simple he would of left no one raped murdered lives saved so on and so forth daugher be eating her captain crunch the next morning
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« Reply #41 on: August 03, 2009, 08:26:09 pm »

The king doesn't like mc donalds.  Look at my avy.
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Ress
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« Reply #42 on: August 03, 2009, 08:40:08 pm »

Who doesn't love McDonalds???

Burger King and Taco Bell pwn McDonalds, but I do like the Double Quarter Pounder Azn

Taco Bell lolololol.  How's that meat? 

BK does make great burgers, but McD's is way better.
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the KR3AT3R
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« Reply #43 on: August 03, 2009, 08:43:07 pm »

I think all their burgers are poop.  Abd taco smell sucks ballzach with their powdered meat.  A good burger is at in and out.
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« Reply #44 on: August 03, 2009, 08:44:16 pm »

A good burger is from my grill.
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